The new weapon perk trees all feel very samey now. Some of the trees are nearly identical. I was really hoping that shuffling perks around out of relic tier would be to open relic tier for 2-4 perk options that change how you use the weapon like how the BSR and SBR have the ammo restore on reload based on how many enemies you hit. (by the way this perk has never worked as advertised, it does not seem to count penetrating hits as additional enemies hit and has only ever been one shot can count as one hit)

Over-all many weapons had their identities stiped away and some have actually ended up weaker than before based of the reshuffling of perks.

I know you are (for no good reason by the way) ignoring "ideas" but really the perk rework should not just have been shuffling around perks and adjusting values, it should have been changing the way the weapon perks work in the first place. Rather than a two-path tree it should have been altered to a couple perk choices per tier. two choices (pick one) for base weapon, 4 choices for master crafted (pick 2), 6 choices for artificer (pick 3), 6 choices for relic (pick 2 plus 2 free points to spend on lower tiers) then an additional free point for mastering relic tier to be spent on any tier. This removes the horrible feeling of not being able to get to the end of the tree if you like the stuff in the middles due to the perk tax of hopping up and down at the 2 fixed positions then getting locked out of one of the two paths. This would have lead to more build variety and you could have made it so players have more meaningful decisions that "well I guess I have to take this shitty perk in order to get this one I actually want" which is how it currently works. There are STILL perks that are just plain bad in the trees baring the way to goo perks.

I agree with you that a lot of weapon trees end up looking pretty similar based on collecting the best perks. It would be pretty nice to chose X number of perks per tier without being restrained to traveling in a straight line. But all in all, I feel like the flat percentage damage increases aren't super great as perks. Like maybe they could just add percentage damage increases at the different rarity tiers you fully master the weapon? It might make it feel like your marine is getting more familiar with the weapon, instead of the weapon itself growing in power instead.

On a related note, my favorite perks on the weapon trees are the ones that unlock different moves/behaviors/functionalities for the weapon. Like for moves the double stomp for the chainsword or the shoulder bash for the combat knife. Or a change in behavior of function like the stalker bolt rifle doing more damage at long range, etc, etc. Having more of those would probably feel a lot better than just taking perks for just flat damage increases, IMO anyway.

what made me chuckle is the perk on the bolt sniper that increases damage of the first shot in the mag by 50%. that coupled with reload on execute sounds cool, right? 

well first of it only works with manual reload and secondly it goes counter to the ammo-refill talent on the bolt sniper, since the game rounds down on the 50% refill.

so, assuming the 50% increased damage would actually apply, you are still running out of ammo. and the perks are back to back, the ammo recovery leads into the 50% increase. 

it seems that this entire patch is just "throwing stuff at the wall"

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Mosch wrote:

what made me chuckle is the perk on the bolt sniper that increases damage of the first shot in the mag by 50%. that coupled with reload on execute sounds cool, right? 

well first of it only works with manual reload and secondly it goes counter to the ammo-refill talent on the bolt sniper, since the game rounds down on the 50% refill.

so, assuming the 50% increased damage would actually apply, you are still running out of ammo. and the perks are back to back, the ammo recovery leads into the 50% increase. 

it seems that this entire patch is just "throwing stuff at the wall"

Yup. Reload speed is it's biggest weakness so the reload on execute feels good, too bad it doesn't count as a "reload."

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Mosch wrote:

what made me chuckle is the perk on the bolt sniper that increases damage of the first shot in the mag by 50%. that coupled with reload on execute sounds cool, right? 

well first of it only works with manual reload and secondly it goes counter to the ammo-refill talent on the bolt sniper, since the game rounds down on the 50% refill.

so, assuming the 50% increased damage would actually apply, you are still running out of ammo. and the perks are back to back, the ammo recovery leads into the 50% increase. 

it seems that this entire patch is just "throwing stuff at the wall"

Even with these buffs sniper bolt rifle is still far from "headshot annihilator" on absolute well at least it is right Gathalamor Crusade and Ophelian Liberation-Beta; OL-Alpha is the only option if you want to one shot majoris enemies with "targeted shot" and "vantage point" class-perks tho it only works on ranged tyranid-warriors and rubric marines, melee warriors still need double shot for killing them but ammo is sad with in that case

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Mosch wrote:

what made me chuckle is the perk on the bolt sniper that increases damage of the first shot in the mag by 50%. that coupled with reload on execute sounds cool, right? 

well first of it only works with manual reload and secondly it goes counter to the ammo-refill talent on the bolt sniper, since the game rounds down on the 50% refill.

so, assuming the 50% increased damage would actually apply, you are still running out of ammo. and the perks are back to back, the ammo recovery leads into the 50% increase. 

it seems that this entire patch is just "throwing stuff at the wall"

So that's why it didn't seem like it was working consistently for me! Most of my reloads were coming from the execute-reload perk. Stupid that it doesn't apply the bonus; it absolutely should.

this does not 100% belong here, but instead of opening up another thread i´d like to complain here:

the stat distribution of the weapons sucks & i hoped that the weapon rebalance would touch on this. there are so many cases were people use the artificer versions instead of relic versions because the weapons have those weird distributions of dmg, speed and cleave. i don´t think its "refreshing" to go "well the artificer chainsword is by far the fastest, so i´ll take that" and the balanced relic chainsword rotting forever because balanced is the worst option and it has 1 speed to boot. and this is just one example. i hope the general stat distribution of all weapons gets revisited.