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remove tight formation / coherency mechanic (armor regen dependency on proximity to squad members)

Game modesCo-op

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a month ago
Oct 17, 2024, 12:38:55 PM

issue

armor regen dependency on proximity to squad members makes the player even less self-dependent in a game that was already plagued by robbing the player of self-dependency (reliance on depletable items and long cooldown abilities). it's ever more annoying considering how you made it so it's impossible to deploy as a single marine (it's only impossible to escape the players, not bot marines because they'll keep teleporting to you). i hoped lethal difficulty will introduce friendly fire so i can get rid of anything that takes tyranids' focus away from me and interrupts my fights. it even removes your armor regen when you are THE ONLY MARINE LEFT, which means that YOUR ARE the squad.

it also disproportionately nerfed bulwark, making conviction perk he's reliant on absolutely useless. all other 1st column core perks are useless for survival.


playing below highest difficulty will not work for players like me either because i need more challenge, despite of how difficulties above minimal remove power fantasy with the way they increase challenge.


in both SM1 and SM2 i do indeed sometimes have urge to stick to my battle-brother, and when i do, i simply follow them and ensure their safety which brings me enjoyment. but sometimes i just want to go forward and jump into a bloodbath. you can follow me if you want. it becomes a problem when the players are being forced to do it even if they don't want to by making them artificially weaker if they don't comply.


if you want marines to cooperate with each other instead of trying to sabotage each other, why not ensure that everyone playing together actually want to play together? why won't you stop forcing everyone to only be able to play operations with other marines unless they get them killed thru sabotage? why not do something like what i described in the idea here?

besides, those who want more challenge (like myself) will intentionally be trying to stay away from the squad.


solution


get rid of that mechanic and instead increase the difficulty by increasing percentage of larger tyranids and/or tyranid numbers. do not increase challenge by making player weaker because it ruins power fantasy SM franchise is all about. instead, do so by throwing more at the player.


I've posted a thread here explaining why player self-dependency is so needed.

Updated 10 hours ago.
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a month ago
Oct 17, 2024, 1:19:53 PM

This.
Giving us a worthy opponent is a challenge. Breaking our kneecaps and then pushing us back into the same thing as before is just a bad time.

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a month ago
Oct 17, 2024, 5:24:52 PM

Whoever at Saber thought that punishing the players getting left behind would prevent other players from running off on their own needs to get their head checked.

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a month ago
Oct 18, 2024, 11:40:41 PM

i personally don´t think it has to be removed necessarily but at least it needs to be changes considerably.Like right now we only get punished through this mechanic.Give us a incentive to stay together. 


Ideas:


1. The Range is just too small and doesn´t allow the classes to play optimal in their own way wihtout being punished (snipers not being able to stay further behind and melee focused classes being punished for going in unless u have 1 or 2 other melee focues squadmates. So increase the range by at least 3x-5x


2. A small buff for staying together that can be felt like for example:

- 10-15% resistance form ranged attacks/ melee attacks

- a slow life regeneration/armor regeneration

- reduction on the ability cd




Updated a month ago.
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a month ago
Oct 19, 2024, 12:37:49 AM

Exostar468 wrote:

i personally don´t think it has to be removed necessarily but at least it needs to be changes considerably.Like right now we only get punished through this mechanic.Give us a incentive to stay together. 


Ideas:


1. The Range is just too small and doesn´t allow the classes to play optimal in their own way wihtout being punished (snipers not being able to stay further behind and melee focused classes being punished for going in unless u have 1 or 2 other melee focues squadmates. So increase the range by at least 3x-5x


2. A small buff for staying together that can be felt like for example:

- 10-15% resistance form ranged attacks/ melee attacks

- a slow life regeneration/armor regeneration

- reduction on the ability cd




why should players be punished for playing how they choose to play? isn't that a horrible way to make a difficulty?

and besides, it incentivizes players who want to increase challenge (like me) to do the OPPOSITE of staying together.

Updated a month ago.
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a month ago
Oct 19, 2024, 2:07:26 AM

One suggestion I've seen and really liked was removing coherency but also removing the armor you get back when parrying minoris outside of the blue light execution. That way minoris hordes are actually threatening and it becomes dangerous to blindly rush into them, they're no longer just seen as free armor, their presence would no longer make nearby majoris actually easier to fight, and unlike coherency it doesn't force you into a specific style of play.

Updated a month ago.
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a month ago
Oct 19, 2024, 4:05:36 AM

players seeking a higher challenge, playing below the highest difficulty is not an option, as it fails to provide the necessary level of difficulty. However, the current approach to increasing difficulty by weakening the player detracts from the power fantasy central to the Space Marine franchise. Instead, difficulty should be increased by introducing more or larger Tyranids, maintaining the player’s strength while enhancing the challenge through enemy numbers and size. This approach would preserve the essence of the game while providing the desired difficulty for players who thrive on intense combat scenarios.

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a month ago
Oct 19, 2024, 6:58:37 AM

Agree, it would be much better to stay powerfull and just getting more Enemys like 2 carnifex at once and more hordes of enemys instead of getting so much more dmg and no way to Refill your armor fast enough..yesterday i killer 3 liktors on lethal difficult just to get killed from a minoris, that i was Not able to reach fast enough because i had 3 liktors in my back :(

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Implemented

The IMPLEMENTED status designates ideas that have been implemented in the game.

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